All The Important Performance Fords Were In The RS's Introduction

"SVTyler" (svtyler) 02/03/2015 at 08:23 • Filed to: None

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But they missed the one that started it all in the Focus :( #nonbiased #blatanthomerism #neverforget #itsnotthatslow #coolerthananAston #workingclasshero #uwotm8 #thanksobama

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 08:25

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And what about the performance oriented escort that appealed to the youths in America?

SVTyler > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 08:27

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It was strange they didn't include any American cars in the presentation what with this being a 'world' car. I know the primary market will be Europe but they could've thrown us a bone or two, maybe an SVO Mustang at the least.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 08:29

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never heard of it.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles 02/03/2015 at 08:31

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Escort ZX2 S/R.

KirkyV > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 08:33

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I'm sure that, if they'd made an equivalent video for the soon to be 'world car' Mustang, there'd have been nary an RS, XR, ST or whatever else in sight. Ford may sell close to everything globally now, but there's still a significant cultural divide between their European and American divisions. (Indeed, I seem to remember reading that, under the current company structure, Ford Europe explicitly handle everything Focus-sized and below, while Ford US deal with everything bigger, with a little fuzzy crossover for cars like the Fusion and new GT.)

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 08:35

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well I can see that lol. I've never heard of the S/R trim.

looks cool. I like those wheels, a lot.

http://www.dailyturismo.com/2013/08/2k-for…

nafsucof > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 08:42

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people don't like to admit it but on tracks in their day those could keep up with type r integras

SVTyler > KirkyV 02/03/2015 at 08:43

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That's actually a really good point, I'm just trying to look at it from a non-European's perspective: the target market will be Evo and STi owners (not exactly a lot known for their taste in classic European motoring), and here in the States I bet a majority of those potential buyers didn't recognize more than a couple of the cars they brought out. Then again, throwing a Mustang or Falcon in would've seemed out of place so it's probably a good thing I don't work for Ford's marketing division.

(Indeed, I seem to remember reading that, under the current company structure, Ford Europe explicitly handle everything Focus-sized and below

Today I learned, thanks for the info.

nafsucof > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 08:46

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this was the first focus performance concept the cosworth focus. No speak of RS when this came out.

KirkyV > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 08:53

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I'll have to try digging up the article where I read that about the size-divisions, just to be sure—I found it while I was looking for stuff about the Fusion/Mondeo, since it's in a rather awkward position as a car that's likely to be a good deal more popular in the US than it is in Europe, in spite of it being a development of the formerly Europe-only Mondeo.

I suppose you have a point about American viewers not really being likely to know all that much about the RS' European performance heritage, but then, would the American STi/Evo crowd have responded all that well to a procession of Ford's American performance cars? I could be wrong, but I didn't think they were really keen on that sort of thing, as a general rule.

Besides, I'm fairly sure this reveal was primarily made with a European - British, specifically - audience in mind. Ford still expect the RS' traditional markets to garner the most sales for this generation, and the 'superhatch' segment that the RS helped establish has never been more competitive in Europe than it is now—they really need to put their best foot forward with the advertising for the Mark III.

SVTyler > KirkyV 02/03/2015 at 09:02

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I think it's the association of performance more than the type of cars being showcased that would intrigue potential customers, if that make sense. While it's apples to oranges, everyone knows what a Mustang is so tying that kind of performance into the new RS might've attracted more attention as compared to a Capri or Escort. Then again, Evo owners would've just turned up their noses at the Mustang most likely, I'd love to see Ford's research on the marketing demographic for the RS just to see what they think their customer base is.

And I definitely agree this car wasn't built for American customers, especially with the hot hatch arms race happening on your side of the world. If the old RS is anything to go off of this thing should be a hoot.

SVTyler > nafsucof 02/03/2015 at 09:10

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Was this a Ford of America concept? Everything I'm finding says SVE and John Coletti worked on this thing with Cosworth, no mention of Team RS or any European involvement.

KirkyV > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 09:12

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Much like the Mustang in Europe, I'm not entirely sure they know exactly who they're trying to sell it to—they just want to give it a go, to see how far they can push this whole 'One Ford' thing.

If they get a lot of nibbles, they've unlocked a new revenue stream for cars they were going to build anyway; if they largely fall flat outside of their home markets, then they'll have established their limits, and won't go to the extra expense of trying to sell the next iteration of each car abroad.

Personally, I'm hoping the Mustang does well enough here that other manufacturers start sniffing at the RWD coupé market, but not so well that it doesn't drop in value like a stone from a skyscraper. I'm actually a bit of a FWD nut, as anyone who's seen my posts on the RS articles, and my many, many .gifs will know, but I'd love to see more options in the sorely under-served RWD coupé market—though, it has to be said, I'd like those options to be a good deal smaller and lighter than the Mustang. An ND coupé would be just fantastic.

nafsucof > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 09:18

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I think the Cosworth was the European involvement because they also did the work on the cylinder heads in the SVT and the ST 170. I think Cosworth still had more ties with ford then.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 09:19

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Because that was just a badge. The SVT Focus had far more bespoke engineering and parts added to it compared to the ordinary Focus models.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 09:29

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Why the ST170 picture?

Also the Gen-1 Focus RS was developed from the beginning of the Focus program. They were going to have AWD all the way back in 2002 but they realized it would make the car too pricey for the typical buyer and it was too costly to engineer given their finances at the time.

That's why the exhaust tunnel on the SVT runs down the center. They were going to put a drive shaft there instead.

I also want to say that the ST170 was only sent back to Europe after the SVT here in the US was developed. They changed it for the Euro market, but it was essentially a US package they sent back over to recoup development costs.

Which is really funny to think about how they then added the EAP option after 2002.

I could be entirely wrong.

RazoE > nafsucof 02/03/2015 at 09:36

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I remember this concept! It had LCD (yes, LCD) tail lights.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) 02/03/2015 at 09:40

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Actually no, the S/R model had a lot of high end parts on it too. New Tokico shocks, eibach springs, Ford Racing ECU tune, Roush intake, polyurethane bushings for the chassis and suspension, upgraded dual-friction clutch, short throw shifter, and some years had extra unique interior trim and seats. Power went from 130 to 143hp. It also had Goodyear ZR1 performance tires. It was very much the precursor to the SVT Focus which, in turn, was rebadged/repackaged overseas as the Focus ST170.

SVTyler > KirkyV 02/03/2015 at 09:43

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The next few years will be interesting considering Ford consolidated SVT and Team RS into one entity, figure that shows their commitment to the 'one Ford' thing. That being said their homogeneity should benefit customers on both sides of the Atlantic: we get your fun hot hatches and you get our Mustang. I too would love for Ford to make a small ND competitor: 2500lb, maybe give it the 2.0T out of the ST Fiesta and be up a few HP on the Mazda. Problem is the marketing people will shoot that down since it would (or they think it would) cannibalize EcoBoost Mustang sales. Shame too, I'd love to see them bring back a Capri or Escort-like car.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 09:44

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What years were those made?

SVT Focus was 2002-2004.

SVTyler > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) 02/03/2015 at 09:45

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European presentation=European version so as to not confuse the locals. You could well be right, there's so much misinformation out there: I remember reading (no clue where) the RS and SVT were developed around the same time with the SVT being a joint venture between Team RS and SVE , while Team RS and Tickford basically developed the ST170/SVT further into the RS. You can't find anything about these cars apart from anecdotes and hearsay; for example, Car & Driver say that John Coletti fought to keep the US-spec car as close to the Euro one as possible, while MotorTrend talks about SVE developing the car so I dunno. Either way it's rather amusing how convoluted the whole thing is: Ford has the "one Ford" strategy now and it all started with the ST170/SVT, it's just that no one knows exactly how it came about.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) 02/03/2015 at 09:46

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1999-2000. Very rare cars nowadays as it was the Ford engineers "testing out" a performance compact.

SVTyler > nafsucof 02/03/2015 at 09:48

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That makes sense then, especially since it was shown at Geneva. Sad Cosworth wasn't involved with Ford after the ST170/SVT in a production capacity, the world needs more Cossies, even if it's just a head. IIRC ST170/SVT was the last official collaboration between Ford and Cosworth, I know Cosworth still builds YD Duratecs but I think the factory production car work for them ended with our cars.

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 09:54

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The ultimate Hipster Ford then.

And I thought parts for my SVT were hard to find. God, I'd hate own one of those.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) 02/03/2015 at 10:00

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Oh nonononononononono.

THIS is the ultimate hipster ford. Take a guess what it is.

KirkyV > SVTyler 02/03/2015 at 10:02

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It'd be essentially this, but RWD. (Though, being me, I'd actually be perfectly happy if it were FWD...)

I'd heard about the consolidation, though I've yet to find a source that actually explains exactly what it really 'means'. I mean, I imagine the former Team RS continue to operate out of Europe, while SVT remain in the US—are the two entities simply sharing ideas and technologies, or does it go deeper than that?

ADabOfOppo; Gone Plaid (Instructables Can Be Confusable) > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/03/2015 at 10:03

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That's a late 80s Escort with a turbo 4. My neighbor had one as his first car, it looks familiar anyway.

SVTyler > KirkyV 02/03/2015 at 10:15

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I didn't know I needed a RWD Puma reboot until this moment. It was so awesomely weird and cool. Ford's riding high at the moment, maybe now's a good time to take some of that profit and goodwill and package it into an ND fighter.

I'd imagine the consolidation is more of a merging of engineering efforts than a centralization of power, with the division of labor being spread out more evenly amongst what was Team RS, SVT, and FPV (don't forget about the Aussies, either). Streamlining and consolidating the model range should make for a more efficient design and production process since they'll all be working together on the same cars instead of their own region-specific ones, which is good because Ford Performance (the new name of the three) said they'd have 12 performance models within 5 years so they'd best get busy.